Concubines

[Stormbringer]

CONCUBINES



- Concubines may be male or female

- There is no restriction upon the number of concubines a player owns apart from their ability to support such

- Each concubine requires two equip slots the same as a slave

- A concubine is considered owned property.

- The nature of the private relationship between owner and concubine is defined by the players

- A concubine's public behavior is regulated by their owner except in them having the same social requirements as a free person from an IG perspective

- Concubines may not own other concubines or slaves

- A concubine is not required to show deference to free people

- Restrictions on a concubine's ability to carry and use weapons is decided in OOC terms between the players of owner and concubine

- A concubine does not have the same limitation over employment as a slave does

- Concubines cannot wear a slave collar but may be given some other indication of their status if wished. This could be anything from a pin to a brand and is decided by the owner.

- Concubines are not captured and sold by slavers and may not be traded or sold by their owner except with IC consent

- Becoming a concubine requires IC and OOC consent but once IC consent is given, the concubine is owned and cannot decide to stop being owned ICly.

- Only concubines registered via the ISA are recognised by the empire.

- The registration fee for a concubine is 50% of the current registration fee for a slave. All other IC requirements for a concubine mirror slave registration

- Terminating a concubine relationship also mirrors the ending of a slave registration

- Registration entitles the owner to appeal to the ISA for assistance if a concubine is stolen or abducted (such assistance being given by an ISA call to the IG).

- The ISA will not monitor or intervene in a concubine's public behavior. The IG may do in the same way as they do with free people

- The IG will not rescue a concubine if she has got herself into trouble any more than they would for a free person. They will only act on behalf of the ISA if it is believed the concubine has been taken forcibly, through no fault of their own, with the intention to temporarily or permanently deprive the owner of his property.

- The ISA will not have the power to change a character's status between free, concubine and slave without the player's OOC consent

- A character can only hold one status at a time between bonded, concubine and slave

- A concubine cannot hold the status of Tu`turadil




TO BE DECIDED

- Does the owner of a concubine pay the same upkeep fee as a slave, since the concubine is kept by that owner? Or does the concubine receive the normal basic allowance and pay their own upkeep?

- A way of marking concubine status in channel, such as concubine_name*OWNER*

- Exactly how a character can move between concubine and slave status after the first month's introductory period



IMPLEMENTATION

- An event or storyline will be introduced to bring concubines into the game

- Following the introduction of concubines, existing slaves who wish to switch to concubine will have a one month grace period when they can apply for an immediate (subject to ISA staff availability) change. No extra waiting times or fees but no refunds either.

- Both owner and slave must post OOC consent to the switch.

- Following that one month grace period there will be set requirements to switch between concubine and slave

- New concubines will have to follow the full registration process from day one

[Stormbringer]

Above is the current proposal for concubines based on the original idea and modified by player suggestions. Please use this thread only to reply to TBD items or to suggest ammendments to this list of concubine rules for the game, not to discuss slave status or the existence of concubines generally.

[Infernis]

TO BE DECIDED

- Does the owner of a concubine pay the same upkeep fee as a slave, since the concubine is kept by that owner? Or does the concubine receive the normal basic allowance and pay their own upkeep?

- A way of marking concubine status in channel, such as concubine_name*OWNER*

- Exactly how a character can move between concubine and slave status after the first month's introductory period

I would suggest the following...

1. That Concubines cost a flat 50 mhl fee for registering with them responsible for paying for their own upkeep.

2. That Concubines have the OOC freedom to take whatever employment position they would like and are qualified for. But, with the understanding that certain higher positions come with the expectation of loyalty to that position and represented authority, as in a Commander of the Imperial Guard who happens to be a Concubine would understand that she has an expectation of loyalty to the Empire and Guard, and not just her owner.

3. The marking in channel is simply a matter of choosing whichever is simplest and less confusing. I would go along with the addition of a 'c' to the usual slave collar, as in {Ic} as amusing as it looks.

4. I would suggest that there be a simple process of either restoring or removing a person's status as a 'citizen' at the ISA office. I prefer the KISS approach.


~I~

[Kaytoo]

As to an IC designation for concubines, what if a generic designation was used such as "Valkstae-C".

The point of such a generic designation to mark those individuals as being of a specific station, yet though owned instantly implying greater freedoms via no associated owner tag. Meaning, the Concubine or those curious and broaching the subject will have to offer or ask respectively. Such a conversation instantly setting up the relationship and status as closer to "bound" then say slave where it is made obvious.

AS TO movement from slave to concubine. I would suggest that existing characters (or new generated during that time for it) during the one month grace period petition for the shift requiring OOC consent of both the slave and owner. If so, then at the end of the introductory period, a mass shift of station is made by those requesting it. In kind I'd suggest for one month after "existing slave/owner relationships" be allowed to petition for the change and instantly make the shift upon approval (to check for the ISA relationship status).........Any other existing relationships after that time must follow the new process, and all new relationships after the initial month must do so as well.

Lastly, there needs to be discussion as to liability regarding others and a concubine. (IOW regarding normal free conflicts (fighting, kidnapping, etc.) and what responsibilities, liabilities and limitations owners and concubines have).

Kaytoo

[lyllamarie]

TO BE DECIDED

- Does the owner of a concubine pay the same upkeep fee as a slave, since the concubine is kept by that owner? Or does the concubine receive the normal basic allowance and pay their own upkeep?

- A way of marking concubine status in channel, such as concubine_name*OWNER*

- Exactly how a character can move between concubine and slave status after the first month's introductory period

I would suggest the following...

1. That Concubines cost a flat 50 mhl fee for registering with them responsible for paying for their own upkeep.

2. That Concubines have the OOC freedom to take whatever employment position they would like and are qualified for. But, with the understanding that certain higher positions come with the expectation of loyalty to that position and represented authority, as in a Commander of the Imperial Guard who happens to be a Concubine would understand that she has an expectation of loyalty to the Empire and Guard, and not just her owner.

3. The marking in channel is simply a matter of choosing whichever is simplest and less confusing. I would go along with the addition of a 'c' to the usual slave collar, as in {Ic} as amusing as it looks.

4. I would suggest that there be a simple process of either restoring or removing a person's status as a 'citizen' at the ISA office. I prefer the KISS approach.


~I~

I agree with most of this, with one caveat for #2. I think while there might not be an imperial law restricting a concubine from a higher position, that with such positions, it would be allowed at discretion for each institution to set their own set of standards. For some, management might not wish to put someone in such a tenable position whose loyalty is first and foremost to their owner -- or they may feel a second-class citizen should not be afforded a position above a first class one.. as an IC mentality. I'd say keep it open, so that if someone wished to implement such an IC prejudice, they can not whine that there is some OOC/IC rule on discrimination..

[gwyneth{StWi}]

gwyn would prefer Master Infernis' method of marking to Miss Kaytoo's, simply because the - is used to designate those who are working (gwyn{StWi}-HH for example) and using it for concubines too may get too confusing, especially for newer players.

Concerning the one month period during which the switch to concubine can be made without penalty, will that time include or be extended to after the new slave public behavior rules are decided? gwyn believes, from talking to O/others, that the new slave rules will have a great part in players' decisions as to whether to make that switch for many of their characters. it will cause less chaos and shuffling around if all the information is presented before that time period expires, and likely an easier transition with fewer frustrated players.

[Sakkara]

I dont think the collar tag {?} should be used, its clear that that tag is for slaves, concubines should have something else entirely.

[Kerianna]

Personally, I's suggest different brackets for marking as well - (), [],\/, or whatever.

I do have a question, too. "- Concubines cannot wear a slave collar but may be given some other indication of their status if wished. This could be anything from a pin to a brand and is decided by the owner." is...odd, to me. Do you mean they're not allowed to wear the {} mark, or that in-game they can't wear collars? If it's the latter, I've really gotta argue against it - I mean, free citizens can even wear collars as it stands if they want, as a fashion statement or whatever, so why restrict it this way?

[Krom]

CONCUBINES

TO BE DECIDED

- Does the owner of a concubine pay the same upkeep fee as a slave, since the concubine is kept by that owner? Or does the concubine receive the normal basic allowance and pay their own upkeep?

I move for a 50mhl registration and 5mhl upkeep for 'tax' purposes. They are still considered property to a degree and there is Imperial Documentation held and upkept ICly about such. Half price and half upkeep in comparison to slave.

- A way of marking concubine status in channel, such as concubine_name*OWNER*

I would not use a hyphen as suggested due to it being for employees declaring their work. I personally, even though it has meaning in other irc mediums... use the [] bracket to determine concubines for OOC flagging purposes.

- Exactly how a character can move between concubine and slave status after the first month's introductory period

I see no reason for this to be muddy. If a person is a slave and wants to be changed to a concubine OR vice versa, then it needs not be an issue. As long as the Owner and slave in questions are both present, a mere subbing of 50mhl can be done for the changing of from types of property and a quick change over in database. A flat 50mhl fee for 'paperwork processing fees'. Any transference of title types must have both ICly at the same time to change it.

IMPLEMENTATION

- An event or storyline will be introduced to bring concubines into the game

A visitation to the southern exploration could be utilized for this purpose.

- Following the introduction of concubines, existing slaves who wish to switch to concubine will have a one month grace period when they can apply for an immediate (subject to ISA staff availability) change. No extra waiting times or fees but no refunds either.

I am in complete agreement with this.

- Both owner and slave must post OOC consent to the switch.

I would add to this that for any changing, both owner and slave must also be present IC.

- Following that one month grace period there will be set requirements to switch between concubine and slave

Again, a 50mhl changing fee, OOC post on forum and both IC for changing required.

- New concubines will have to follow the full registration process from day one

Complete agreement.

[Stormbringer]

Personally, I's suggest different brackets for marking as well - (), [],\/, or whatever.

I do have a question, too. "- Concubines cannot wear a slave collar but may be given some other indication of their status if wished. This could be anything from a pin to a brand and is decided by the owner." is...odd, to me. Do you mean they're not allowed to wear the {} mark, or that in-game they can't wear collars? If it's the latter, I've really gotta argue against it - I mean, free citizens can even wear collars as it stands if they want, as a fashion statement or whatever, so why restrict it this way?

I'm assuming characters don't habitually use OOC knowledge IC. In which case, how do they differentiate between a slave wearing a slave collar and a concubine wearing a collar with her owners initials on it?

[Istoaj]

I suggested the 50/5 for fees thing in the other thread, so I am all for that.

The denotation of how a concubine is marked...I think that Gorean channels use the [] for their slaves, or am I mistaken there? I would rather use something else, if at all possible, if that is the case. I know we can't use (), but as to what to use, I am a little stumped...maybe ||? Like, for example, Twelic|Chris|?

Just a possible compromise.

[Sakkara]

They use {} in Gorean channels.

As for collar wearing, I think theres a fair few non slaves walking around with collars/chokers etc, so why not concubines? I mean they can be branded like cattle but not wear a collar?

[Krom]

[ ]= male
{ }= female

At least in several irc areas in regards to slavery/property.

[Kerianna]

Personally, I's suggest different brackets for marking as well - (), [],\/, or whatever.

I do have a question, too. "- Concubines cannot wear a slave collar but may be given some other indication of their status if wished. This could be anything from a pin to a brand and is decided by the owner." is...odd, to me. Do you mean they're not allowed to wear the {} mark, or that in-game they can't wear collars? If it's the latter, I've really gotta argue against it - I mean, free citizens can even wear collars as it stands if they want, as a fashion statement or whatever, so why restrict it this way?

I'm assuming characters don't habitually use OOC knowledge IC. In which case, how do they differentiate between a slave wearing a slave collar and a concubine wearing a collar with her owners initials on it?

The same way they do now with non-slaves wearing collars/collar-like chokers, presumably. I don't know how that is, per se, but I do know that plenty of people that aren't registered slaves wear them, as Sakkara said.

Maybe that's a good thing, though. Slaves aren't supposed to act like free people, but maybe it wouldn't be so bad if not everyone could just assume to know your status just because you happen to have a collar on. Or at least, not until they can actually get close enough to read the marker and see "oh, that type of ISA mark is a concubine mark, not a slave mark". Not to mention that the option for non-collar marks is there for slaves too (with approval, but still there), so people already can't really just go "oh, all slaves have a collar, and anyone with a collar is a slave". There are already plenty of exceptions to that.

[Tawny]

- A concubine does not have the same limitation over employment as a slave does

I have to say that I dont agree with this part. The Concubine is owned and there for I can see the same problem as was seen with slaves in management postions.

A way of marking concubine status in channel, such as concubine_name*OWNER*

To me I dont really see a need for a concubine to be marked. They are not a slave and have most of the freedoms a free person does. There really isnt a need of someone to be able to identify and concubine IC. If there is to be a mark then a brand or wizard mark if all I personally see them needing..

- Exactly how a character can move between concubine and slave status after the first month's introductory period

I can see this as more of a IC thing between the slave and the owner. Once the owner decided they wish to change then they would need to post their OOC consent and so would the slave char. They would wait one week then come in pay the fee and the slave collar would be removed and paper work filled out making them a Concubine. This of course would go into effect after the first month. However I think there should be a limit of one switch per slave char per owner. Once switched it should be something they can not switch again with the same owner. If there isnt a limit set, then I can see some playing musical collars.