Warrior-Mage Skillset Suggestions

[Vysanth]

Currently, Warrior Mages perform actions just like any other class - they choose either to cast a spell or use a weapon, etc. This proposal aims to change this slightly, giving them specialised "spells" or "skills" to be channelled in various situations.

This Skillset makes the assumption that Warrior Mages are essentially weapon users who are distinguished from mages by the following :
- where mages release spells from their fingertips, they use their weapon to release their magic. being able to strike with their weapon increases the effect of the "spell"
- their magic, unlike mages, is instant-cast on-off abilities. where Mages require one action to buff and the buff stays a long time, the WaM is able to buff instantaneously, but it also lapses after it has served its purpose
- it has proved a big challenge writing some of these Skills, in order for it to be cool enough to be (hopefully) attractive to existing WaMs, but also not too overpowered.

When it comes to Spell access, WaM will retain access to all Arcana sphere except those that require more than Mage x2 and above.
(see http://belariath.com/php/magic/listspel ... ere=Arcana )
- WaMs would retain access : Blood Backlash, Burning Fingers, Chill Touch, Color Spray, Damage Shield, Dampen Flame, Energy Bolt, Far Scry, Fire Bolt, Glimmering Tail, Harden Arrow, Hurl Rock, Ice Shards, Magical Armor, Physical Armor, Quick Foot, Reflux Shield, Rock the Boat, Shocking Grasp, Sleep, Spirit Lash, Stunbolt, Blindness, Deafness, Lavish Attention, Shimmering Armor
- WaMs would no longer have following : Arcane Bindings, Bloodfire, Deadly Repetition, Deviancy, Gravity Sinkhole, Heat Metal, Mimicry;Eye of the Beholder, Mirror Image, Mystical Bindings, Reverse Gravity, Shield of Energy, Spider Climb, Portal, Teleport
- remember, based on the proposal you can only have TWO out of the FOUR trees below...

http://belariath.com/classes/wam.html

WARRIOR MAGE SKILLSET
- these abilities are meant to encourage WaMs to have less Spell Slots and more Skill Points.
- because the maximum effect of any of these Skills are roughly equivalent to an 8 Slot Spell, the net effect would be that WaMs would never be as magically specialised as Mages when it comes to Spells that can be applied using the Skills
- however they do become more reliant on their weapons / armor to bring out maximum effect. in return for this they gain versatility, being able to apply Ranged Spells in Close Combat, or Close Spells in Ranged Combat
- unless otherwise mentioned, none of these Skills may be used simultaneously
- these Skills might gain significant power if Warrior Mages are required to match INT with STR and AGI with RES, and these Skills MUST be revised carefully if the Stat distribution restrictions are completely released because they could be terribly imbalancing.
- these Skills may not be used in conjunction with multi-attack, or AoE spells. they are meant solely for Single-Target spells.

CLOSE COMBAT TREE
- combines spells with a melee weapon, ideally taken if the WaM is attuned to a melee weapon
- essentially identical to RANGED COMBAT TREE

Skill Name : Arcane Slash (Combat)
Class/Race Restriction: Warrior Mage
Level: 10 (Tier 1)
Description : The character is able to charge his weapon up with the magical energies of a spell, turning the weapon temporarily into a contained shape of arcane energies and combining the two to deliver a close attack to deliver the arcane effect of the spell.
Mechanics : This Skill may be used in conjunction with any single-target Arcana spell that uses RanMagAtk or CloMagAtk, but which must be known by the caster. Every 1 Point costs 2 Sta, and adds +2 ATK to the ATK roll. The character attacks using a CloPhyAtk, adding the modifier of the weapon used, and the modifiers from this Skill. The target defends using CloPhyDef but his armor is ignored, although Defensive enchantments can help protect him.
The effect when struck by the weapon is exactly the same when struck by the Spell with slots equivalent to twice the number of Points used. Note that the character can use a <Arcane Slash 4> to land Blindness, even if he has only 1 slot in Blindness it can have an effect equivalent to 8 slots in Blindness.
If the spell does no damage the attack does no damage as well

Skill Name : Sorcerous Strike (Combat)
Class/Race Restriction: Warrior Mage
Level: 20 (Tier 2)
Pre-requisite : Arcane Slash (2 Points)
Description : Similar to Arcane Slash, the character is able to charge his weapon up with the magical energies of a spell, turning the weapon temporarily into a contained shape of arcane energies and combining the two to deliver a close attack to deliver the arcane effect of the spell. That being said he is better able to control this balance, so that it retains more substance while still containing spell energies - making it capable of doing damage as well as releasing the spell's effect.
Mechanics : This Skill may be used in conjunction with any single-target Arcana Spell that uses RanMagAtk or CloMagAtk, but which must be known by the caster. Every 1 Point costs 2 Sta, and adds +2 ATK to the ATK roll. The character attacks using a CloPhyAtk, adding the modifier of the weapon used, and the modifiers from this Skill. The target defends using CloPhyDef but his armor is ignored, although Defensive enchantments can help protect him.
If the Spell's sole effect is to damage, for every Point used the character may extra +2 damage to his Max Damage before rolling for damage.
If the Spell has other effects, the character must declare in his attack if he wants the spell effect (eg. Stun, Blindness) or damage to be priority. On landing a blow, the priority immediately occurs.
Thereafter, the defender can roll an additional, identical roll to defend, not requiring any Sta. If his second roll is lower than the character's initial ATK, he also suffers from the second effect (usually damage).
Note that both effects are applied simultaneously, so the person struck by a weapon with Sleep takes damage and falls into Sleep immediately ; he does not Sleep first, then taking damage, wakes up.

OOC Note : essentially identical to the Arcane Slash, BUT with a slight difference... able to apply damage and effect in a single strike. Getting a strong ATK roll is important to making this work well.

Skill Name : Focused Thrust
Class/Race Restriction: Warrior Mage
Level: 30 (Tier 3)
Pre-requisite : Sorcerous Strike (2 Points)
Description : The character is able to focus his considerable talent for focus and balance enhancing his strike with his intellect and magical ability, letting his attack tread the fine line between the physical and magical worlds, to maximise the chances of landing a successful and devastating hit on his target. However this is draining and the use of it is limited.
Mechanics : This Skill may be used in conjunction with any single-target Arcana spell that uses RanMagAtk or CloMagAtk, but which must be known by the caster. Note that this skill does NOT ignore the target's armor.
When executing this attack, in addition to rolling Str and Agi for the CloPhyAtk, the character may make an extra roll either with his Int or Res, and take the best 2 of the 3 rolls to be his effective ATK roll before modifiers.
The first Point costs 4 Sta, thereafter every 1 Point costs 2 Sta. If the Spell's sole effect is to damage, for every Point used the character receives an extra +2 damage to his Max Damage before rolling for damage. Otherwise it determines the effective number of Spell Slots if the attack should hit.
Number of Points in this Skill is number of times it may be used in one day.

RANGED COMBAT TREE
- combines spells with a ranged weapon, though not necessarily requiring ammunition, ideally taken if the WaM is attuned to a Ranged weapon
- essentially identical to CLOSE COMBAT TREE

Skill Name : Arcane Shot (Combat)
Class/Race Restriction: Warrior Mage
Level: 10 (Tier 1)
Description : The character is able to focus the magical energies of a spell on his ranged weapon, firing a contained shape of arcane energies to deliver the arcane effect of the spell.
Mechanics : This Skill may be used in conjunction with any single-target Arcana spell that uses RanMagAtk or CloMagAtk, but which must be known by the caster. This attack need not use any ammunition, unless the character wishes to use the ATK bonus provided by the ammunition.
Every 1 Point costs 2 Sta, and adds +2 ATK to the ATK roll. The character attacks using a RanPhyAtk, adding the modifier of the ranged weapon used, and the modifiers from this Skill. The target defends using RanPhyDef but his armor is ignored, although Defensive enchantments can help protect him.
The effect when struck by the shot is exactly the same when struck by the Spell with slots equivalent to twice the number of Points used. Note that the character can use a <Arcane Shot 4> to land Stunbolt, even if he has only 1 slot in Stunbolt it can have an effect equivalent to 8 slots in Stunbolt.

Skill Name : Sorcerous Streak (Combat)
Class/Race Restriction: Warrior Mage
Level: 20 (Tier 2)
Pre-requisite : Arcane Shot (2 Points)
Description : Similar to Arcane Shot, the character is able to focus the magical energies of a spell on his ranged weapon, firing a contained shape of arcane energies to deliver the arcane effect of the spell. That being said he is better able to control this balance, so that it retains more substance while still containing spell energies - making it capable of doing damage as well as releasing the spell's effect.
Mechanics : This Skill may be used in conjunction with any Spell that uses RanMagAtk or CloMagAtk, but which must be known by the caster. If the spell used is a damaging spell, this attack need not use any ammunition, unless the character wishes to use the ATK bonus provided by the ammunition.
Every 1 Point costs 2 Sta, and adds +2 ATK to the ATK roll. The character attacks using a RanPhyAtk, adding the modifier of the weapon used, and the modifiers from this Skill. The target defends using RanPhyDef but his armor is ignored, although Defensive enchantments can help protect him.
If the Spell's sole effect is to damage, for every Point used the character may extra +2 damage to his Maximum Damage for every Point used, before rolling for damage.
If the Spell has other effects, the character must declare in his attack if he wants the spell effect (eg. Stun, Blindness) or damage to be priority. On landing a blow, the priority immediately occurs.
Thereafter, the defender can roll an additional, identical roll to defend, not requiring any Sta. If his second roll is lower than the character's initial ATK, he also suffers from the second effect (usually damage).
Note that both effects are applied simultaneously, so the person struck by a weapon with Sleep takes damage and falls into Sleep immediately ; he does not Sleep first, then taking damage, wakes up.

OOC Note : essentially identical to the Arcane Shot, BUT with a slight difference... able to apply damage and effect in a single strike. Getting a strong ATK roll is important to making this work well.

Skill Name : Focused Fire
Class/Race Restriction: Warrior Mage
Level: 30 (Tier 3)
Pre-requisite : Sorcerous Streak (2 Points)
Description : The character is able to focus his considerable talent for focus and balance enhancing his strike with his intellect and magical ability, letting his shot tread the fine line between the physical and magical worlds, to maximise the chances of landing a successful and devastating hit on his target. However this is draining and the use of it is limited.
Mechanics : This Skill may be used in conjunction with any single-target Arcana spell that uses RanMagAtk or CloMagAtk, but which must be known by the caster. This attack need not use any ammunition, unless the character wishes to use the ATK bonus provided by the ammunition. Note that this skill does NOT ignore the target's armor.
When executing this attack, in addition to rolling Str and Int for the CloPhyAtk, the character may make an extra roll either with his Agi or Res, and take the best 2 of the 3 rolls to be his effective ATK roll before modifiers.
The first Point costs 4 Sta, thereafter every 1 Point costs 2 Sta. If the Spell's sole effect is to damage, for every Point used the character receives an extra +2 damage to his Max Damage before rolling for damage. Otherwise it determines the effective number of Spell Slots if the attack should hit.
Number of Points in this Skill is number of times it may be used in one day.

DEFENCE TREE
- basically a defensive tree

Skill Name : Arcane Protection
Level: 10 (Tier 1)
Description : With his ability to channel magical energies through physical means, this character is able to instantaneously call upon the protective powers of magic for a moment to ward off an attack. While not as strong as an actual invoked spell, it is still potent and the low duration makes it easier to deploy.
Mechanics : For every Point in this Skill, the character is able to instantly activate up to 2 slots of an Arcana defensive spell upon being attacked at the cost of 1 Sta per Point. This effect is instantaneous and lasts for only that attack.
The player can choose to do this AFTER the oponent's ATK roll is made, but he must announce his cast spells BEFORE he rolls his Defence. Note that the player of the character must inform the attacker that the attacker is entitled to reroll his ATK, the attacker can choose whether or not to do so before the character's DEF roll is made.
Defensive Arcana spells include Magical Armor, Physical Armor, Shimmering Armor. The spell must be known to the character in order to be used. Note that such use of Spells may not stack with existing Defence Spells

Skill Name : Offensive Defence
Level: 20 (Tier 2)
Description : With his ability to channel magical energies through physical means, this character is able to instantaneously call upon the powers of magic for a moment to to erect a magical shield capable of inflicting damage on his attacker. Such defences are more complex than mere protective spells and require a higher level of expertise and concentration to invoke.
Mechanics : For every Point in this Skill, the character is able to instantly activate a defensive "backlash" spell upon being attacked at the cost of 2 Sta per Point. There are 2 "modes" possible for the caster to choose - Damage or Reflux.
"Damage" returns a damaging bolt to the attacker if and only if the character is injured by the attack.
"Reflux" returns a damaging bolt to the attacker if and only if the character is NOT injured by the attack.
The bolt auto-hits the attacker and does 1d(3 x number of Points used) damage.
This effect is instantaneous and lasts for only that attack.
The player can choose to do this AFTER the oponent's ATK roll is made, but he must announce his cast spells BEFORE he rolls his Defence. Note that the player of the character must inform the attacker that the attacker is entitled to reroll his ATK, the attacker can choose whether or not to do so before the character's DEF roll is made.
Because this Skill is a hybrid, BOTH Arcana spells Damage Shield and Reflux Shield must be known to the character to use this Skill. Note that such use of Spells may not stack with existing Defence Spells.

Skill Name : Resolute Resistance
Level: 30 (Tier 3)
Description : With his ability to channel magical energies his defense, he is able to focus his concentration in an instant to ward off an attack, drawing on both physical and arcane capabilities at his disposal. Such an effect is so potent it can cause his entire person to temporarily blur partially out of existence so he might take less damage, but it is draining and limited in use.
Mechanics : It costs 5 Sta to activate this ability, and in addition to making his Defensive roll, the character can choose to roll 1 out of his 2 other stats also. The highest 2 out of 3 rolls is his effective DEF roll, before mods.
Number of Points in this Skill is number of times it may be used in one day.

MORPHOLOGY TREE
- an adaptive tree that allows the WaM to control to a certain extent his effective Stat outlay for that battle.
- they can generally be used with other skills
- this tree is probably more valuable to WaM because of their Stat restrictions

Skill Name : Battle Adaptation
Level: 10 (Tier 1)
Description : Just prior or in the opening of an engagement, this character is able to quickly refocus some of his wide disciplines in a way that he deems beneficial for an advantage against his opponent(s). However maintaining this requires more concentration than normal for every move he makes.
Mechanics : For every Point in this Skill, the character is able to assign increase any of his four Stats by 2 at the beginning of battle. They remain in effect as long as the character spends 2 extra Sta per action to maintain the Adaptation.
Other Skills may be used while Adaptation is in effect.
He can choose to let it lapse during battle but may not use it again during the battle.

OOC Notes : The main downside to this skill is the Sta Cost. At 2 Points, this is pretty expensive costing 2 Sta for 4 Stat points. At 3 Points and above though it might be considered reasonable.

Skill Name : Unstable Adjustment
Level: 20 (Tier 2)
Description : This character is so attuned to adjusting his own abilities in combat situations that he is able to instantaneously tune his capabilities to maximise the effect of an action he does, especially against a stronger opponent. While it is somewhat tiring, it is an unstable inconsistent advantage because of the suddenness with which sometimes its required, and can be maintained only for that action.
Mechanics : For every Point activated, the character spends 2 Sta to instantaneously increase increase any of his four Stats by 1d5, for that action only. This roll must be made everytime this skill is activated.
Other Skills may be used simultaneously with Rapid Adjustment.
If he uses it in Attack, he must declare before rolling ; if he uses it in a Defence AFTER the oponent's ATK roll is made, but he must announce his used Skills BEFORE he rolls his Defence. Note that the player of the character must inform the attacker that the attacker is entitled to reroll his ATK, the attacker can choose whether or not to do so before the character's DEF roll is made.

Skill Name : Discipline Channel
Level: 30 (Tier 3)
Description : This character is in full control of all his faculties and abilities, able to adjust them to suit his situation at his whim. By concentrating for one round in combat, he is able to re-channel his ability in various areas to enhance himself, allowign him to move with increased speed and agility, hurl potent spells, be more damage resistant, or even grow in size and strength to an extent. This discipline needs extra effort to maintain but can be very potent.
Mechanics : Unlike all other Skills in this Skillset, this Skill requires one action to activate, costing 3 Sta per Point. Every Point used allows the character to take up to 10% of his points from one stat (rounded down) and put it into any other stat.
This effect remains as long as the character spends 2 extra Sta per action to maintain the Discipline Channel ; once lapsed it has to be re-activated. Other Skills may be used while Discipline Channel is in effect.

OOC Notes : well used, it is very handy, and makes for good RP outside of battle. Assuming all 4 of a WaM's stats are equal, it can increase a particular Stat by up to 40% of its normal value. poorly used though, it allows the opponent a chance to exploit a previously non-existent opening. This is a versatile Skill among the trees though it may not look impressive. It can be extremely unbalancing if a non-WaM is allowed to use it.

=============

Hope you guys like this it was a tough to think of something that might be attractive to WaMs, but I think it was worth it because I'm quite happy with the result, and its fun. Yes, a little lazy on the first two trees, basically they are one and the same tree. That being said I am still a little concerned if its overpowered when combined with certain spells. Looking forward to feedback!

[miyuka]

I like it. Would make WaM's a bit more unique than just having the same basic spells that a Mage can have, and it would make Mages a bit more unique in that there won't be as much people running around using some of their spells. Hell I think they should just have seperate sphere's period but that might be a bit much...Hopefully the dev's will take many ideas (if not all) from this post and add them to WaM's.

[Keegan]

I like this. This would make the WaM stand out a bit more as their own class. I would like to see this happen.

[lyllamarie]

- where mages release spells from their fingertips, they use their weapon to release their magic. being able to strike with their weapon increases the effect of the "spell"

I'm confused if this is the proposal or what is already in effect, as I don't agree with this. Sure it can be done as an aesthetic effect, but I do not think their spell casting should be defined or required of a weapon. Infact, currently it is not, that is why we are restricted to one-handed weapons. One hand to wield, one hand to cast. That was essentially one of the advantages was that we only require one hand to cast.

- their magic, unlike mages, is instant-cast on-off abilities. where Mages require one action to buff and the buff stays a long time, the WaM is able to buff instantaneously, but it also lapses after it has served its purpose

Is this what your proposing, or what is already in use? Because it takes a WaM just as long to cast defensive/prep spells as any other. Other then what you have posted for Class skills, I'm not of the opinion it should change.

WaMs would no longer have following : Arcane Bindings, Bloodfire, Deadly Repetition, Deviancy, Gravity Sinkhole, Heat Metal, Mimicry;Eye of the Beholder, Mirror Image, Mystical Bindings, Reverse Gravity, Shield of Energy, Spider Climb, Portal, Teleport

We don't have access to these spells anyways.......

as to the skill tree, I see alot of mechanical talk, not alot of aesthetic or descriptions to distinguish one from the other. Yeah. I like the flowery descriptors, but I am getting lost in all the mechanical talk. To me, just going over them it seems alot of mechs are just being repeated in a different skill. Examples should be posted, and what are these points? How many does the Class get and when?

[Vysanth]

I'm confused if this is the proposal or what is already in effect, as I don't agree with this. Sure it can be done as an aesthetic effect, but I do not think their spell casting should be defined or required of a weapon. Infact, currently it is not, that is why we are restricted to one-handed weapons. One hand to wield, one hand to cast. That was essentially one of the advantages was that we only require one hand to cast.

This is a proposal, as far as my very limited knowledge goes it is not in effect.

I agree with you totally in that I do NOT think WaM spellcasting should REQUIRE a weapon. In fact, nothing in my proposal states that they REQUIRE a weapon just that (new) Warrior Mages may end up becoming more reliant on casting through their weapons. The reason will be mentioned based on above Mechs -
Observe a WaM with 3 Points in say, Arcane Slash/Slot, can bring out the effect of say, a Stunbolt 6 without needing 6 slots in Stunbolt - he only needs 1 slot in Stunbolt. If a (new) WaM applies this in practicality, he would probably have 1 slot of every spell that he generally wishes to use, and maybe 2-4 Points in Arcane Slash/Shot depending on his tendency. This by no means indicates he cannot cast those spells without his weapon, but using his weapon he actually brings out better effect. Plus of course the Weapon ATK bonus is now added to the roll. Which is more effective?
That being said, if he does intend to get 15 slots in a Spell he will still need to buy 15 Slots of the said Spell, and can cast it on its own, without the ATK bonus etc. There is less incentive to do so however, it is not to say that he cannot do so. Besides, if he already has 3 Points in Arcane Slash, he basically gains no advantage in buying slots 2-6 of the Spell - it is just Mhl thrown in so that he can reach the higher slots.
More choices to make Hence the Skills are not restrictive, but by offering a limited advantage, they *may* result in players finding it more worthwhile not to be as specialised as Mages, more worthwhile to cast through their weapons, but it is not that they CANNOT obtain 15 Slots, it is not that they REQUIRE weapons to cast.
Good to understand the distinction and the reasoning behind how the mechanics encourage the fulfillment of the statement but it is by no means restrictive, nor does it require any significant changes on the part of existing WaMs with 15 slot spells (unless they have those odd spells that you mentioned, to your knowledge, are Mage-only spells)

EDIT : In retrospect, using 4 Points of Skills (1500 mhl) to exchange for up to 7 Slots of *every* Single-target Arcana spell is waaaay too much. Perhaps this should be amended so that the default Spell effect is 1 Slot, and every Point adds +1 Slot to the Spell effect, which would give a 2-5 Slot effect on being struck.

Is this what your proposing, or what is already in use? Because it takes a WaM just as long to cast defensive/prep spells as any other. Other then what you have posted for Class skills, I'm not of the opinion it should change.

It is a proposal, it is NOT what is in place. The only spell so far that I see which well exhibits this well is Harden Arrow. I feel, again its just an opinion, it is something that well characterises the WaM class over that of a Warrior or a Mage.

We don't have access to these spells anyways.......

I'm not sure if that is the case. Last I checked I saw some with some spells, but I might have been mistaken or it has been already fixed.

as to the skill tree, I see alot of mechanical talk, not alot of aesthetic or descriptions to distinguish one from the other. Yeah. I like the flowery descriptors, but I am getting lost in all the mechanical talk. To me, just going over them it seems alot of mechs are just being repeated in a different skill. Examples should be posted, and what are these points? How many does the Class get and when?

You are quite correct to say that the aesthetic and description are left vague for 2 reasons -
1) Aesthetics will change depending on the Spell invoked with the Skill. even from Spell to Spell different Players have different liking on how say, their Firebolt looks like, or in this case, perhaps how their Flaming / Icy Sword / Arrow looks like. It would not be meaningful to try and capture all the possibilities in a single description.
2) As per my Warlord proposal, not being a WaM I am not someone to propose a lot of very interesting descriptions to tie OTHER players down to. I' m certain actual WaMs can come up with Descriptions and probably also revise the Mechanics to something more suited to their liking.

So how do they gain these Skills? I guess this is the first you have seen of this Proposal, so I'll quote relevant bits here.

Cost and Points
Spell slots 6-15 are usually bought via Stat Points on level up to make the cost less prohibitive, but this proposal assumes that it would be difficult to program Skills the same way.
- Skills have max of 4 Points, each Point is roughly equivalent to 2 Slots in a Spell.
- They should cost slightly less than Spells as they cannot be bought with Stats, so their proposed cost is
100 mhl for 1st Point
200 mhl for 2nd Point
400 mhl for 3rd Point
800 mhl for 4th Point

A quick comparison of the cost between Skills and Spells
Spell (2 slots) costs 200 ; Skill (1 point) costs 100
Spell (4 slots) costs 400 ; Skill (2 points) costs 300
Spell (6 slots) costs 1000 ; Skill (3 points) costs 700
Spell (8 slots) costs 2000 ; Skill (4 points) costs 1500

Note that cost is a proposal and subject to revision, especially given characters now only earn a pocket money of 20 mhl / mth.

Tiers
Skills are divided into 4 Tiers, Tier 0 to Tier 3.
Tier 0 is similar to spells from levels 1-5, available to Basic Classes
Tier 1 is similar to spells from level 5-15, available to Advanced Classes
Tier 2 is similar to spells from level 15-25, available to Advanced Classes. Generally requires x2 of that Advanced Class.
Tier 3 is similar to spells from level 25-40, available to Advanced Classes. Generally requires x4 of that Advanced Class.
In general, each Tier would have 4 OOB Skills and 4 Combat Skills. If the purpose of Tier 0 is to encourage more RP (which I assume it is), it would be well to have 6 OOB and 2 Combat Skills for a Tier 0 Skillset.

The choice to limit Tier 1-3 to Advanced Classes is so that no character can have Skills from two different Skillsets greater than Tier 0. However, in future it is good if at least a T1-T3 Skillset should be made available to characters who do not take up Advanced Classes, similar to how Bards, Mages and Shamans get a Sphere all to themselves.

Every character should generally have no more than 4 Skills from every Tier. Out of these 4 Skills, max of 2 may be Combat Abilities. This reflects their specialisation and also character's IC personality, which is good for RP.

Progression
At Level 01, Character starts with 2 Tier 0 Skills, max 1 is Combat. He does not have to pay for them. All other Skills have to be paid for in order to be learnt (similar to Spells)

Level 05 : Character gains another 2 Tier 0 Skills, max 1 is Combat.
If due to Dual-Classing, he gains access to another Tier 0 skillset, he can pick Skills from that Skillset, so long as he gains only max of 2 Tier 0 Skills, and max 1 is Combat.

Level 10 : Character gains 2 Tier 1 Skills, max 1 is Combat.
Level 15 : Character gains 2 Tier 1 Skills, max 1 is Combat.

Level 20 : Character gains 2 Tier 2 Skills, max 1 is Combat.
Level 25 : Character gains 2 Tier 2 Skills, max 1 is Combat.

Level 30 : Character gains 2 Tier 3 Skills, max 1 is Combat.
Level 35 : Character gains 2 Tier 3 Skills, max 1 is Combat.

As you can see, the advancement in power in Skills is a lot slower than Spells. But this gives RP room in between to refine a learnt Skill or to strive and pick up a new one, the next target.

As you can see from the proposal, the max number of Trees accessible to any individual is TWO, not all FOUR. It is also quite possible for a WaM to choose to take up Defence and Morphology Trees, ignoring the two offensive trees. Different WaM players probably have different preferences. This is also a way that I hope Skillsets can help to differentiate players from each other.

I know we're not WoW, but just as an example, there's Feral Druids and Boomkin Druids ; Assassination Rogue and Combat Rogues. Similarly, I think we could do with a bit more variety in TLI

Full details on Topic Link - viewtopic.php?f=45&t=8627

[Ielenia]

portal was available at one time to WaM at one time I do know for a fact.


though I have to say i am pretty happy with WaMs the way they are now if we could just get use of the class skills back

[Alta_Nova]

Ielenia.

I believe I still have the original WaM write ups since I was part of that almost 7 years ago. I am still digesting the material that has been posted and will get back to you on this soon

AN

[Alta_Nova]

I am still digesting this concept abit. however I can say that right now that this line of thought goes away from how I percieved on how a Warmage should have or act.

I strongly suggest to work on the WaM personality aspects first before trying to work out some aspects of spells.

Another aspect is lets try to make things as simple as possible without Power Creep involved.

I'll keep mulling this over some more.

[Tahni]

I'm in agreement with Alta on this one. I think we need to concentrate more on what a Warrior Mage is right now then start working on skills and spells. Though i still like they way some of it sounds and your post does intrigue me. though i can't say i like the morphology tree very much. It seems to me that it's a lot of math the WaM has to go through before each battle. And being a person not to savy in math kinda puts me off on that tree. On the flips side the Close combat and Ranged combat tree interest me. For the def tree most of the spells sound a lot like the def spells already in place, Magic Armor, Phyiscal armor and Damage shield.

[Vysanth]

What is a Warrior Mage?
Currently it looks like an excuse to have the best of both worlds on a character. They can wear almost all good looking armor, and also cast Mage x 7 spells. That last bit on the Mage x 7 spell really doesn't seem to make much sense to me, but perhaps I could be misinterpreting things here.

Back to the question...
If its about taking pride in combat, something like Gladiator or Pitfighter would be more appropriate.
If its about having spells suited for mass warfare, a DND Epic War Mage casting normal spells but having a ridiculous AoE, would be appropriate (and totally unsuited for TLI)
If its about being totally balanced... eh wait. What does that translate to in RP?

Down to it, it is simply probably going to slant one or two ways
- a Warrior that uses some Magic to become a better Warrior
- a Mage, that has some Warrior training and is able to hold some decent ground in physical fighting.

To my rather limited understanding, the second doesn't mesh too well together, so the concept put forward here is simply that Warrior Mages are using their magics to enhance their physical prowess, that is simply it. In other words - mainly warriors that use some "spot" or "instant" magic to make their attacks more effective, or make their defences able to hold out against a particularly potent attack. The benefit generally are immediate, takes up no action, but are very Stamina-expensive for how long they last, which is probably only seconds.
And the last bit (Morphology) is built on the presumption that Warrior Mages will continue in their 4-equal-stat philosophy, but have skills to redress this shortcoming and have some adaptiveness. The writing can be simplified to be less Math-Intensive.
This will make them unique, because any Stat-ted character in TLI is fixed to an extent in his statistical capability to handle any given opponent. But Warrior Mages will be able to dynamically "shift" their capability in a certain direction to exploit the (perceived) strength / weakness of an enemy.

The Skill Tree is only meant to bring out the Concept, and can/should be open to editing for clarity where necessary. But if Warrior Mages are not going to lose anything, then it makes no sense to give them more Skills when they already have so much advantage to them.

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Off a separate note, Power Creep is a meaningful term when there is an objective measurement from Class to Class. This measurement should be sufficient to include to account all their abilities under whatever Sphere / Skill / etc they have, to be a comprehensive and complete means of measurement.

If there is no means of measurement, then there is no actual grounds for saying "xxx Class is weaker than yyy Class" unless it was blindingly obvious, such as some classes having Spheres and some classes not having Spheres. Even then, how to address the problem so that "weaker" Class is up "even" instead of "somewhat weaker than" or "somewhat stronger than" will forever remain an unsolvable solution. There will be revision after revision after revision, year after year after year...

[lyllamarie]

Where are you getting that they can cast Magex7 spells?

[lyllamarie]

a WaM has no access to Magex7, maybe they did before, but not anymore. They gain magex1 spells, and unless they advanced at a later stage, say level 15 or level 20, they would not have access to high spells.

they are also restricted in armors A,B.C, and of those, metal must be mithril or specified otherwise. They can not stagger their skill points like a straight physical or magical can do when it comes to stats, which in Sutara's experience can make her as strong as someone 30 levels lower, but not as strong as someone only 2 levels higher.

[Vysanth]

Where are you getting that they can cast Magex7 spells?

Ah they don't? That's good to know

Just wondering, does a Warrior Mage x 1 class count as a Mage x 1 ?
ie a Warrior Mage x5 will have access to Mage x5 spells ?
What about the Illusion Sphere etc that Mages have access to but not Warrior Mages?

Though of course they could have got it before they upgraded to Adv Class, same as other upgrading processes.

They can not stagger their skill points like a straight physical or magical can do when it comes to stats,

I once had an argument with someone who used to be a Warrior Mage who supported this change about the time it was implemented, but shortly after the changes went live he reset to another classs for any number of reasons.

Is it worth considering that INT must match STR and RES must match AGI? It would co-relate to Physical matching Magical, but the Character can determine how Offensive / Defensive he would like to be.

[lyllamarie]

no a WaM is not the same as a Mage past Magex1. Not unless you decide to go Magex1,x2,x3 before advance classing will you gain access to that level of spells. Or if you dual class.

just as with any other class, if a WaM had access to illusional spells prior to the advancement, they can purchase additional slots for an existing spell they own at the SS, but will not gain access to those slots/spells via level up's.

[Phaing]

Will this be approved?

I'm interested, but it does seem a bit complicated.